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'They don't need any more help': Dallaglio voices fears over SA sides in Champions Cup
By Josh Raisey
After a season and two rounds of South African sides being in the Investec Champions Cup, a familiar theme has already started to appear.
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Ten games played at home so far by South African sides and ten victories for the hosts. Reigning two-time champions La Rochelle were the latest side to travel south of the equator and come home empty handed- although a losing bonus point could be regarded as a comforting consolation.
While the South African sides do not necessarily fare too well when travelling (the Stormers and Bulls both losing their matches on European soil in the competition), this is a theme that does not sit well with two-time winner Lawrence Dallaglio, who feels the new competition only benefits the South African sides.
The former England captain raised his concerns on the Evening Standard Rugby Podcast this week, suggesting that the change in conditions and quick turnaround for northern hemisphere sides put them at a disadvantage when travelling to South Africa. On top of that, he worried that the South African sides’ participation only strengthens South African rugby, which he believes is already set to dominate rugby for the coming years.
“The South African concept is not one that sits that comfortably with me at the moment,” the Wasps legend said.
“Some people would argue differently. Maybe the players would. I don’t know, I’d love to hear what the teams themselves think about traveling to South Africa, playing at altitude and in the heat, having been there for five days and then having a quick turnaround and having to then play another game the following week.”
“I think that the South Africans are very good at rugby. We know that they’ve just won the Rugby World Cup again for the fourth time, they don’t need any more help.
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“So I don’t like the fact that we give them more help by introducing them to European Champions Cup Rugby. I think the only team that it benefits are the South Africans really.
“I think that it’s probably a move that’s irreversible, particularly given that (new sponsors) Investec have now invested significant amounts of money and Investec have a big South African presence. South Africa will probably win the next two or three World Cups without any more help from us.”
LD is wrong. Much like SA playing SR/RC made the ABs and Australians stronger, this will help England and the NH in general.
The rugby is a good product for a wider audience so global viewership is up. New markets entirely.
What would be interesting is a Real Champions League. Maybe that shortened version of the game ala Rassie and Co…
Or not.
Would Love to see the top in Japan/NZ etc playing against the best teams in Europe and SA.
I think he was just joking. I think New Zealand will be very offended by the idea that European Club Rugby will make South African rugby stronger compared to what Super Rugby did.
I wonder if he also want European and Japanese clubs to stop using the 132 South African players that play for them? If he sends them all back home South Africa can have a very strong local competition. It seems he wants all the benefits of using South African players and coaches for European Clubs but he doesn't want there to be any benefit for South African rugby.
As for South African teams benefitting from the traveling, it is truly funny. In Super Rugby, Rugby Championship, Tri-Nations, and the URC, South African teams always travel more than teams from other countries. Even if there is now a slight benifit for South African teams in the Investec Championship it will be the first time ever that South African teams get a benifit when it comes to travel.
South Africa has the second largest rugby viewing public in the world. In the long run the benifits to European Clubs are going to be massive.
I think these comments and the fact that he sat on the board of a liquidated club explains a lot about why the Wasps crashed and burned. Must have been a Brexit voter.
The URC had zip tv revenue cos nobody gave a flying, they thought bringing the Sarfers in would change that, they were wrong so now they have ruined the Heiny as well. The whole thing stinks of officials money grubbing.
That's cute and all, but the URC is doing much better in terms of viewers and quality since the SA teams joined.
Where did you come up with the idea that there hasn't been a viewership increase?
Perfectly right Lawrence.
We have enough trouble keeping our own clubs solvent, without adding more expense flying to SA. Keep the income in Europe and help our own.
SA are financial contributors to rugby with only France having a bigger tv audience for rugby.
Lawrence so obviously biased and prejudiced he believed Wasps (his old club) should have got special treatment and when you have Leinsters head coach Leo Cullen speaking highly of SA teams contributing to URC and Champions Cup you know how out of touch Lawrence is. What does he want? SA to face isolation again? He discredits himself
You would expect somebody who sat on the board of a Premiership club that went bankrupt to know better.
Click….
So you don’t actually have something to add, you just hate South Africans?
Click….
I thought the URC quality generally improved across the board with the Saffers joining (despite Welsh wobbles) compared with the old PRO & Celtic comps … or not?
It’s a fact plus huge jump in viewers
I'm not keen on SA in NH competition mostly because its just an odd arrangement wedging one of the SH nations into NH rugby feels untidy. It was more interesting to have the clear divide in hemispheres then a clash at the RWC or an international tour. Plus the demise of Super Rugby is a real shame. I used to love watching games like the Bulls/Sharks against the Crusaders, these epic teams full of stars and contrasting styles was really cool… and I really feel there is no place for in the 6N for SA. The 6N is so good not because of the quality of rugby but because we're all neighbours and rivals. Plus it would devalue the rugby championship and if we're giving out opportunities for development it should be to the likes of Portugal or Georgia, not the 4x world champions. I'm assuming it's not a tantalising financial prospect but a SH rival competition would be great to see with Fiji, Tonga, Samoa included.
As usual, Naaijill the conder wunt is polluting the thread with his unique mix of dumbness, delusions and pathological hatred for all things South Africans. Does this turd burglar have any role here, other than irritating us, the knowledgeable rugby fans?
What’s wrong with you, Naaitril?
Perhaps you should look to Australia and New Zealand for why South African teams aren’t in “Super” Rugby any more. Additionally, they - principally the Australians - tinkered with the formula which took it from a fantastic Super 12 competition to an abomination and I’m glad we left that mess. As for the Springboks participating in the 6 Nations, that remains to be seen, but given that money dictates everything these days, I believe it’s only a matter of time. I’m curious about why you’d think it would “devalue” the 6 Nations; it’s seems much more likely that playing against South Africa would strengthen the existing participants and also put a lot more money in the coffers which, given the parlous financial state of English rugby, would be very welcome. Regarding Portugal, Romania and Georgia, there’s a case to be made for them to participate at some level, but it would seem counterproductive if they were to get flogged everytime they played. Whatever happens, I hope it’s not at the expense of regular South Africa v New Zealand test matches. All very nice to play against all the others, but the real test is and always will be New Zealand. Finally, if you’re going to complain about something, maybe take a look at the mercenary nature of Northern Hemisphere teams. How many South Africans, Kiwis etc that prop up particularly Scotland and Ireland are too many? What a refreshing change it would be if Scotland actually selected genuine Scottish players rather than a South African C team.
I would say if SA was good enough to colonize for empire all those years ago despite the untidy North South divide, then the favour can now be returned by extending a big squashed ball of fellowship :-)
Swings and roundabouts, I'm a bok/bulls fan… I love the ability to watch my team live (I live in England) and still watching the men participate internationally against 🇦🇷🇦🇺🇳🇿, results in win-win-win (#Ubuntu) in the long run with a few teething problems along the way. 😊Yup I see Mr Dallaglio’s point, nonetheless, pls remember that the danger of text is that it can be read in varied ways, which leads to misimpretation, but importantly gets people talking. 🤷♂️
This format does advantage South African rugby from multiple angles, nevertheless, it also levels things up a bit between the hemispheres and I am certain that the Northern Hemisphere players wouldn't be complaining about the overnight flight to pretty much the same timezone which results in experiencing a vastly different world in landscape, culture, yummy food, and a slightly different style of rugby.
At the end of the day, rugby is a professional sport and Africa is a massively untapped market that can contribute in time to significantly growing the sport, when (not if) more African countries get involved through long-term investment which one hopes the introduction of South Africa will hopefully imo, one day prove to be the foundation of growth and the betterment of our sport.
No one can argue that world rugby is stagnating and not trying new things.
In short, if it doesn't work after giving it a go in a couple of years, I am reasonably hopeful a new adaptive format will be implemented. 🏆 😁
Particularly the food. Can’t wait to be there again. Waar’s die wyn!!!!!!
The fact they have won 10 out of 10 at home and their great home records in the URC is more down to the group stage and league format. How many of those games in SA where must win for the away team. Leinster have sent understrengh teams to SA last 2 year.
The current european cup format lets teams send weakened sides to difficult away trips and still make the knockouts.
Like Sale v Leinster last week.
Munster won a URC final down there.
Also teams to better at home isnt that much of a shocker
No wonder English rugby is in such dire straits. Their “legends” are true cry babies. 😭😭😭
Legend se ma se ****
Next 2 or 3 world cups….🤣
Sounds really good to me!
He’s right. And now some idiots are even calling for the Boks to join the 6N. The con is well & truly on.
This is “woke” mentality in Rugby. They are too good and we are losers, I don’t want them in my party mommy.
And there we have more factual evidence that WR is still desperately trying to create the illusion that the weak, sub standard SA teams are competitive. One cannot forget how these mediocre journeymen fled from the SR competition with their tails between their legs after 9 winless seasons despite embarrassing bias and support from the Sanzaar (WR) officials and now the same agenda is being pursued in the NH competitions. It’s now more than embarrassing for us true supporters of the game.
tut tut … antipodean provincial gushing wishful but ignorant bias. them mediocre journeymen just won a wc. yet someone in supreme arrogance sets the standard by which to judge them as ‘sub’? high horsing much?
Oh Nigel,
“more factual evidence” and the best one yet, “us true supporters”.
Come lay down on the sofa and tell us what’s really on your mind, at least tell us how not to end up like you.
I hope it’s not something as serious as your wife leaving you for a South African. Honestly hope you have some love ones around you this Christmas to see that life can be enjoyed even if the Boks are double World Champions.
“Us true supporters” I enjoyed that one…
Wow you are next level delusional 😂
South Africa has done what’s best for them. So would any other nation. They play in Rugby championship, URC, And now the champions Cup. Best of both worlds. It will take time for the English and French teams to adapt to going over there. But their bothwingers when they don't have all the advantages. They did the same thing a few years ago, when Munster, and Leinster kept winning it. They changed the completion format, to suit their teams better.
How does he expect sides to get better to match them if they don’t get chances to be exposed to the gruelling heat and altitude. It’ll balance out, plenty of average URC teams have gotten wins and draws over there, no reason the top European teams can’t as well
Great comment. Playing in South Africa should be seen as an opportunity.