'I'm not convinced': Ex-All Black and broadcaster clash over whether NZR has 'the backbone or the stomach' to help Moana Pasifika succeed
Sky broadcaster Ken Laban has questioned whether New Zealand Rugby [NZR] has “the backbone or the stomach” to ensure Moana Pasifika will become successful upon their entry into next year’s new-look professional competition.
Moana Pasifika and the Fijian Drua were last week granted conditional licences to join a 12-team competition, that will also feature the New Zealand and Australian Super Rugby teams, from next year onwards.
The decision to induct Moana Pasifika and the Fijian Drua into the competition has been widely celebrated as it gives Pacific Island-based players a pathway to professionalism without having to look abroad for opportunities.
That was reflected when Moana Pasifika general manager Kevin Senio confirmed earlier this week that 80 percent of the side’s playing roster would comprise of players who have played or are eligible for those three nations or any other Pacific Island nation.
He said that would leave eight spots for players who are ineligible to represent Fiji, Samoa, Tonga or any other Pacific Island test side.
However, Laban took a cynical view of those restrictions and Moana Pasifika’s inclusion in the competition given the fate of former expansion sides in Super Rugby over the past decade-and-a-half.
Speaking on The Breakdown on Monday, Laban pointed to the inclusion of the Western Force and Sunwolves in previous editions of Super Rugby as examples of expansion teams that have failed to perform as a result of poor governance.
The Western Force were one of two new teams, alongside the Cheetahs out of South Africa, included in Super Rugby in 2006 but were controversially axed from the competition in 2017 as the league downgraded from 18 teams to 15.
The Sunwolves, meanwhile, were one of three new teams included in 2016 but struggled for competitiveness throughout their time in the competition and were dropped last year after posting just nine wins from 67 matches.
Both sides are two of numerous expansion franchises, such as the Southern Kings and Melbourne Rebels, that have struggled for results throughout Super Rugby history.
Laban said he hoped Moana Pasifika – who, unlike the Fijian Drua, are starting from scratch after having only made their debut against the Maori All Blacks last December – doesn’t suffer the same fate as the Force and Sunwolves.
“Not that I want to be negative, it’s certainly not my intention, but I just wonder if our game has got the backbone or the stomach to see this through,” Laban told The Breakdown.
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“We saw with the Western Force they lasted 10 years, but then they were tossed out in very controversial circumstances.
“I was in Japan in 2016 when the Sunwolves played their first game at Prince Chichibunomiya Stadium after, in 2015, the national team beat South Africa, greatest upset of all-time.
“There was huge support. What’s the Japan economy? I think it’s about eighth in the world, 127 million [people]. They last five years, they won nine games out of [67] games.
“Controversial, and in the end, they lost the vote [to remain in Super Rugby], and I look at these restrictions that have been placed on the Moana Pasifika team, and there is nobody in the world of rugby that wants to see the Moana Pasifika and the Fijian Drua teams fail.
“We want it to be successful. They’re not going to be successful if everyone hides all the players from them.”
Effectively accusing NZR of stockpiling the country’s best Pacific Island players from being recruited by Moana Pasifika, Laban used Blues props Ofa Tuungafasi, Karl Tu’inukuafe, Nepo Laulala and Alex Hodgman as examples of NZR withholding their top talent from the new franchise.
“As an example, Tuungafasi and Tu’inukuafe are not starting at the Blues because Hodgman and Laulala are starting, but they’ve been re-signed, so Moana Pasifika doesn’t have access to them.”
He added that Hurricanes duo Asafo Aumua and Vaea Fifita also fall under similar conditions.
“Dane Coles has just re-signed for the Hurricanes through until 2023, so what does that mean in game time for Asafo Aumua? Under these rules, Asafo – very proud, young Samoan kid – can’t play for Moana Pasifika.
“Vaea Fifita. There’s another example. I love Vaea as a player, I wish he gets more game time at the Hurricanes. He’s a big, strong, aggressive player. Under these rules, he’s not eligible for Moana Pasifika, but he’s somewhere back in the depth chart [for NZR].
“I’m not convinced that we are setting them up to be successful if we’re just going to keep all the good players off them.”
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Ex-All Blacks wing Sir John Kirwan said that, while he agreed that Moana Pasifika need to be competitive as soon as they enter the new competition, he disagreed with the notion that signing capped All Blacks would be beneficial for the franchise.
The former Italy, Japan and Blues head coach indicated that he views Moana Pasifika and the Fijian Drua as vehicles to improve the Fijian, Samoan and Tongan national teams, and the make-up of their playing squads should reflect that.
He added that now those teams are set to be inducted into the new league, they are in direct competition with their future opponents for playing talent.
Kirwan said that in the case of Moana Pasifika – who Senio confirmed will initially be based out of South Auckland, where both the Blues and Chiefs have a strong presence in – competition for signing players may be tougher than if they were based in Samoa or Tonga.
“This is where I disagree with you because if you are in South Auckland, and I’m the Blues or the Chiefs, I’m going to sign my kids for 10 years. This is now about competing for the money that’s out there that’s thin on the ground anyway,” he said.
“I don’t know if bringing back some of the elder statesmen of Pacific rugby who are towards the end [of their careers] is helping Pacific rugby, to be fair.
“You bring back Jerome Kaino, what is he going to do for Pacific rugby moving forwards? That’s what I’m worried about.
“Nothing against Jerome, so my problem is maybe we need to say, ‘If you’ve played under 10 test matches for New Zealand or Australia, or even England’ – remember we’ve got some Pacific Island boys up there – ‘you can go back and play for Samoa, Tonga or Fiji, and then you can play for Moana Pasifika’.
“I would prefer to see that, and then, they’re coming back to play for a reason and they can go and represent Tonga, Samoa and Fiji in the World Cup.”
Kirwan added: “You put them in this competitive environment, there’s not enough money out there for the three of them [Blues, Chiefs and Moana Pasifika], but if they’re in Samoa, I reckon it’s different.”
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Senio told The Breakdown that Moana Pasifika’s recruitment plan was to balance the acquisitions of foreign-based Pacific Island players with those currently playing their trade in “national A-level” leagues and national U20 programmes in Fiji, Samoa and Tonga.
However, Laban suggested Moana Pasifika need the best possible players available for them in order for the franchise to hit the ground running as a competitive outfit.
He used the Brisbane Broncos and Melbourne Storm in the NRL, and the New Zealand Breakers in the NBL, as examples of expansion franchises that succeeded upon their inclusion in their respective leagues because they were given a free licence to sign who they wanted.
The Broncos made their debut in what was then known as the NSWRL in 1988, won their first premiership in 1992, and have since gone on to claim six titles.
The Storm, meanwhile, first entered the NRL in 1998, won their first title a year later, and have become one of the competition’s most dominant sides after having won six titles – two of which were stripped due to salary cap breaches – and missing the play-offs just twice since their inception.
As for the Breakers, who entered Australia’s premier basketball competition in 2003, the Auckland-based team have gone on to claim four championships, including a hat-trick of titles between 2011 and 2013.
“My point is about the quality of the roster. Those three franchise teams [Breakers, Broncos and Storm] that have been unbelievably successful, franchise extension teams, was because they were allowed access to quality players,” Laban said.
“Obviously with our game, you can’t win without the ball, so you need quality players that can win the ball.
“So, we go back to that argument about there are 20 Pasifika players in the Wallabies. There are 17 in the All Blacks. That’s 37 of the elite Pasifika players that Moana Pasifika doesn’t have access to.”
He added: “I’m just saying do we want Moana Pasifika to be competitive? Otherwise, are they going to follow the same route as the Force and the Sunwolves?”
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Kirwan countered Laban’s point by questioning what success means for Moana Pasifika if those who play the franchise, like capped All Blacks, can’t go on to “help Samoa and Tonga at the next World Cup”.
“But what’s success, Ken? What I’ve understood is success is helping Samoa and Tonga become more competitive,” Kirwan said.
“You pick those players, that’s not going to help anyone, so all I’m saying is if you want to help Samoa and Tonga, then make some rules.
“Make some rules where, actually, we can sustain this for the next 20 years. There’s no use picking Ofa Tuungafasi because he’s going to do nothing for Tonga.”
Former Chiefs, Crusaders and Fiji assistant coach turned Sky Sport analyst Tabai Matson weighed in on the matter by taking a balanced approach to both Laban’s and Kirwan’s arguments.
The former All Blacks and Fiji midfielder agreed with Kirwan that the sustainability of Moana Pasifika is crucial, noting that developing a pathway into the franchise for local players in Samoa and Tonga is vital for the region’s long-term success.
“I think there’s two things here. There’s the chat about the pathway and the sustainability, and on the back of that is the strategic alignment with Tonga and Samoa, so there is the pathway of players coming from the Islands into that platform,” Matson said.
“It will definitely help the World Cup programmes, or the international programmes, because they’ll have a platform to bring their players in and play at a consistent level. That’s really, really important.”
However, he reaffirmed Laban’s point that Moana Pasifika need to target the best possible players available to them in the early stages of their existence, even if that means signing capped All Blacks, to make themselves as competitive as possible.
“They’ve got to compete straight away because they get a first impression and everybody [will be] watching them when they play the Blues or the Crusaders at Eden Park or down in Christchurch, and so they’ve got to compete off the bat.
“If that means that they’ve got to bolster it with some old dogs coming back, then I think that’s going to be really important.
“One of the things the Pacific Island is famous for is they’re way-finders. They’ve found a way, and I think this gives them the platform to find a way. There’s no best practice so far, but they’ll find a way.”
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best news and very helpful
4 Go to commentsA year ago Ireland and France looked impressive. In this 6N neither looked special. Both have lost good players, but more importantly teams have figured out how to shut them down. In particular the Irish loss to a rebuilding England and the home game struggle against a brave Scotland did nothing to prove that the Irish RWC result was undeserved. If the Scots can shut down the Irish attack, then SA can do so with interest. Rassie will have watched that game with confidence. Farrell is smart, and the Irish team is talented, so we should expect a more creative game plan in SA. But if all they bring is what they showed against Scotland then Ireland is going to struggle against the Boks. It was a fun 6N tournament, but the win for Ireland was as much about weak competition as about Irish brilliance. It was mostly due to France being off the boil, Wales and Italy not being contenders, and Scotland being a home game. England are looking much better, but “much better” should not be enough to topple a team that is supposed by some to be The Best in the World. I hope that Ireland can bump it up a notch or two for the Bok tour. A year ago they were fantastic to watch. It would be great to see that again.
24 Go to commentsLooking forward to the Wallabies being competitive again. No doubt that Joe can get them back on track.
1 Go to commentsThanks, Nick, not only for this fine article, but for all the others during 6N 2024. I really enjoyed this 2024 tournament, and felt it was one of the best for many years. That final match in Lyons was really good. England were certainly unlucky when that speculative hack by Ramos lead to a French try. It could just so easily have landed in English hand.s, and they score at the other end. I did think though that the French played some great rugby, and some of their driving play in the forwards was just fearsome. I watched Meafou with interest, and he has a good start to his career. It is interesting to compare him with Will Skelton. Lot of similarities, though so far Meafou has not shown any offloading threat. All credit to Borthwick for being prepared to change, and what great result, even if that last game was lost at the death. I feel they are a real chance to cause the AB’s problems this winter/summer. Finally a comment on Ireland. I thought their last game was their worst, and they did not look like the world’s No 2 side at all. What really worries me is that the loss to England was, in my view, down to poor decision making by the coaching group, and ofc Andy Farrell wears that. It was a big mistake to move JGP away from scrum half. Murray should have been the one to go to the wing. And the “finishers” should have been on the field earlier. And this is the second time this has happened. The RWC Qf against the AB’s, and not getting Crowley onto the field was a huge mistake. Finally, finally, watching Italy play was a joy. How wonderful that they are no longer the punchbag of the 6 N.
43 Go to commentsGreat story. Rugby needs new investment in teams like Brussels another pro league in Europe would be great.
1 Go to commentsAlso, looking at the data from last year, it seemed like by far the two biggest predictors of success were (1) kicking more than your opponents, and (2) having a higher rate of line-out wins than your opponents. I haven’t gone through the stats this year with a fine tooth comb, but the increase in kicks per game and the increase in tries from lineouts would suggest that these two metrics are only getting more important. England’s move away from a kick-heavy game to win against Ireland was seen by some as evidence that running rugby is on the rise. Alternatively it could be taken as evidence that if one team kicks more, and the other team wins more lineouts (as England did) a match is bound to be close to a draw.
2 Go to commentsI have been finding it odd that points per 22 entry has become such a talked about stat, given that your points per entry can be driven down by having more entries. These data would seem to confirm that it isn’t a useful metric, or at any rate is less useful than total entries.
2 Go to commentsI think the last two games England have played is some of their best rugby they have played under Borthwick. There has been a lot more attacking instinct and as a reward have created some well worked tries. Ollie Lawrence is a good foil at 12 as he offers the hard direct lines whilst the rest of the backs can play open. As much as it pains me to say but I do hope England keep playing this way. On a side note my favourite try of the weekend was Lorenzo Pani’s for the nice loop play that put him away and his finish was excellent. Thanks as always Nick.
43 Go to commentsMost exciting player on the planet right now, worth the price of a ticket.
1 Go to commentsBen Smith and Ireland live rent free in Safa’s heads. Their comments only triggers because its true. If the Boks had dismantled a 14 man AB’s, then there would be more respect. But they didnt, in fact quite the opposite, the 14 man NZ were clearly better. And the Bok have always been ordinary between RWC’s, thats why their supporters are now ‘only RWC’s matter’. They know thats BS. Its BS to both AB’s and Bok’s due to their history. But now its all the Safas have. Now we’ll hear excuses when they lose “oh we didnt have all our players available, the ABs/France/Eng/Irel were at full strength”, forgetting for a minute that its because of their own dumb policy. Oh well, makes a change from blaming ‘cheating refs’.
24 Go to commentsNo Nick, they did not, in fact, justify any ‘probables’ label. At no time did they seriously compete for the championship. Ireland led from start to finish and in the end, as a result of glaring referee errors, were never under serious pressure to lose their crown.
43 Go to commentsMoney for him, and his family, has been the sole motivator since he signed for Queensland aged 17. Why else sign for Melbourne. Tupou is poorly advised. If he’d stayed and developed in NZ he would have had a long Test career. If Leinster offer him a few more coins than he’s currently earning, he’s goneburger.
4 Go to commentsFinn. No one would say Ford had played well up until the last game. One standout performance in 5 is hardly in form . It should be a given that a 10 will control play . Not in Fords case be praised for suddenly doing so. Where was he against Scotland ,Italy. The pundits were saying how far away from play he was standing and one even said that the Ireland game was his last chance saloon to perform . Not exactly top form catching anyones eye. If he can play like this game after game then great. Keep him in . But after 90 odd caps we all know he just doesnt keep it going . By all means keep him there but the issue is that Borthwick will persist even when he plays poorly. Which is more often than not. Thats why i am concerned that Smith ,despite fab form , cannot get a game at his preferred spot. Can you imagine Ford at full back .
5 Go to commentsI do not really get why put Ollivon at 6 when he’s a 7, while Cros was the best Frenchman of the tournament, playing at…6. His only game replacing Aldritt at 8 doesn’t change much in terms of his impact. Lamaro was also outstanding in that brilliant Italian side, probably better than Reffell. So putting 2 Welsh players from the wooden spoon holders, and none of the 4th nation (Scotland) is also strange. Is it about showing that in this harsh transition Wales is, there were some standouts…?
6 Go to commentsThe events at this year’s six nations should undermine many of the arguments made against promotion and relegation between the six nations and the REC. If Italy had been allowed to yo-yo between divisions it conceivably could have really hurt their development, but if Italy, Wales, and Scotland are all at risk of relegation, with none of them being relegated more often than once every 3 or 4 years, you’d have to back all of them to muddle on through it, especially when you factor in the likelihood they’ll still be guaranteed world league matches against tier 1 opponents. Another way of looking at italys resurgence would be to say that the development model of adding an extra team to the six nations has worked, and now must be done again. Georgia could join to make it a 7 team round robin, and if and when Georgia demonstrate an ability to consistently win games, Portugal can also be added to make it an 8 team 2 conference competition. Frankly at this point I think it falls to world rugby to demand that the 6N act in the interests of the game. If the 6N won’t commit to expansion then the 6N teams should be handicapped in world cup draws (i.e. world cup seedings would not be based on their ranking points, but on their ranking points minus a 5 point penalty).
6 Go to commentsSteve Borthwick deserves credit for releasing the shackles on his England side and letting them play in a manner that somewhat resembles the top sides in the Gallagher Premiership. Will they revert to type in New Zealand in July.?
43 Go to commentsJames Lowe wouldn't get in any other 6N team. He's a great example of Farrell’s brilliance, and the Irish system. He is slow. His footwork is poor. But he fits perfectly in that Irish system, and has a superb impact. But put him in another team, and he'll look bang average.
6 Go to commentsCrusaders reached their heights through recruitment of North Island players, often leaving those NI teams bereft of key players. Example: Scott Barrett and Sam Whitelock robbed the Canes of their lineout and AB locks. For years the Canes have struggled at lock. This rabid recruitment was iniated by rule changes by a Crusader dominated NZR Head Office. Now this aggressive recruitment has back-fired, going after young inside back Hamilton Boys stars. They now have 4 Chiefs region 10s and not one with the requisite experience at Super level. Problems of their own making!
4 Go to commentsOver rated for a long time…exposed at scrum time too.
4 Go to comments“Firing me” should have been Gatland’s answer.
2 Go to comments