A 13 man shortlist of England's Number Eight options and their 'pros' and 'cons'
In the world of Eddie Jones, it never rains but it pours, it seems.
Having already lost Sam Simmonds to a long-term injury and having an expected suspension hanging over the head of Nathan Hughes, England saw their starting number eight, and arguably most influential player, Billy Vunipola break his arm for the third time in a year at the weekend.
With Vunipola and Hughes having played the bulk of minutes for England at number eight over the last three seasons, Jones is now in a predicament over who to turn to for the upcoming autumn internationals.
To make matters worse, the versatile and experienced Chris Robshaw has also gone down with injury and though he was unlikely to be the man tasked with filling the eight jersey, the loss of experience will have a knock-on effect on the entire back row unit.
We have rounded up all the possible options Jones could look at to fill the berth when he announces the squad tomorrow, with pros and cons on each of the candidates.
Continue reading below…
Watch: Warren Gatland speaks about his selections for the autumn internationals, including the uncapped Jonah Holmes.
Don Armand, Exeter Chiefs
The people’s champion, it seems. Fans have been clamouring for Armand’s inclusion since he became eligible for England, but as of yet, Jones has been reluctant to use him in all but the most serious of injury crises or shortages of available players.
Could losing those four back rowers be enough to force Jones’ hand?
Pros: Brings the physicality Jones likes in back rowers, a good ball-handler and has the engine to play at a high level for 80 minutes.
Cons: Little international experience, plays in unfavoured Exeter system and doesn’t carry enough in the tight, apparently.
Zach Mercer, Bath
The coming force, Mercer has been making people sit up and take notice of his abilities in the Gallagher Premiership and Heineken Champions Cup for over a year now. He was involved with the England set-up last season as an apprentice and now, with another year of experience under his belt, the calls are getting louder for Mercer to be involved.
Pros: Brings alternative ways to win the battle at the gain-line, more mobile than England’s current back row options and is an adept operator at the breakdown, too.
Cons: Little international experience and deemed too lightweight for the grunt work by some.
James Haskell, Northampton Saints
Haskell is by far the most experienced option at Jones’ potential disposal over the next month of international rugby. He has fallen out of favour with England since multiple injuries last season, but it shouldn’t be forgotten that he played a key role in England’s early success under Jones.
Pros: Wealth of international experience, versatility to cover across the back row and packs a punch in the tight, as both a carrier and a tackler.
Cons: Hasn’t had the hottest of starts to his time at Northampton, not the most adept ball-handler and has had the seven jersey, Jones’ preferred position for him, snaffled by Tom Curry.
Ben Morgan, Gloucester
Despite not featuring for England under Jones, Morgan has picked a good time to hit form and put his injury woes behind him. He has been impressive in recent weeks for Gloucester and they are a club that Jones has frequently been watching in the 2018/19 season.
Pros: Closest to a like-for-like replacement for Vunipola, in a good vein of form and another who can pick up the tough yards close to the ruck.
Cons: Moderate international experience but hasn’t been involved in the set-up under Jones, Gloucester have not proven a popular club for the Australian and he is, you would suspect, either the starting number eight or not involved at all.
Brad Shields, Wasps
Most people are expecting Shields to be included tomorrow, having previously been involved in South Africa earlier this year, but could he be included as a potential number eight? He has been talked about as an option for England on the flanks, but he spent plenty of time at eight during his final season with the Hurricanes.
Pros: Solid ball-handler, offers ability at the breakdown and has a good understanding of upcoming opponents, not least so the All Blacks.
Cons: Not the explosive carrier that some of the other options are, little international experience and not the most powerful around the fringes.
Matt Kvesic, Exeter Chiefs
The former Gloucester openside has been revelling in his role at the base of the scrum this season with Exeter and it’s something which has put his carrying ability front and centre. He now looks one of the more well-rounded back rowers in the Premiership.
Pros: Breakdown ability, versatility to cover multiple positions and an underrated carrying game in the tight.
Cons: Not a favoured player of Jones, little international experience and may not be considered to be a ‘natural eight’.
Mark Wilson, Newcastle Falcons
Another flanker impressing in the eight jersey for his club, Wilson has the upper hand on Kvesic in that he has been regularly involved in England training camps over the last year. He is another player to have started the 2018/19 season in good form and there are similar calls for Wilson to be picked that there are for Armand and Mercer, especially since Robshaw has also now been sidelined.
Pros: Versatility across the back row, has a skill set that is admired by Jones and brings an energy and work rate defensively that England could be missing with Robshaw out.
Cons: Relatively inexperienced as a number eight, used to the England environment but not overflowing with international experience and not the powerhouse carrier that Jones has favoured in the past three seasons.
Dave Ewers, Exeter Chiefs
Not a regular starting eight for Exeter but someone who potentially ticks a number of the boxes Jones is particularly keen on at the position. Touch wood, he seems to have shaken off the worst of his recent injury issues and has been quietly finding form in the south-west.
Pros: Very powerful around the fringes, makes dominant gain-line tackles in defence and possesses the natural size that Jones craves.
Cons: Little international experience and not frequently playing number eight in the Premiership.
James Chisholm, Harlequins
A former Junior World Player of the Year and England U20 captain, Chisholm’s opportunities at the senior level have yet to manifest. He has been a consistent performer in an inconsistent Quins side over the last couple of years and has naturally filled out and become more physical since his U20s days.
Pros: Wins at the gain-line in alternative ways, impressive mobility around the park and endeavours to keep phases alive whenever possible.
Cons: Little international experience, doesn’t tick the size box for Jones and has, internationally, lived in the shadow of Robshaw and Jack Clifford at Quins.
Teimana Harrison, Northampton Saints
Another ‘undersized’ option to go with Mercer and Chisholm. Harrison was initially favoured by Jones and England after the 2015 Rugby World Cup, but he was unable to cement himself into the side and his opportunities have been sparse since he received the shepherd’s crook in the first half of the Test against Australia in Sydney in 2016.
Pros: Wins at the gain-line in alternative ways, offers impact at the breakdown and brings an edge to his game.
Cons: Fallen out of favour with England, little international experience and seen by some as a flanker, rather than a number eight.
Jackson Wray, Saracens
If there’s one thing we know about Jones, it’s that he likes a Saracens player. That said, Wray and Alex Goode have been the two noteworthy absentees from England during the Australian’s tenure, despite impressing consistently at club level. Is Wray the reliable option Jones needs to get through this tricky patch?
Pros: Brings enviable work rate and stamina, has a good all-round game and enjoys chemistry with much of England’s current pack.
Cons: Little international experience, not a powerhouse carrier of the ball and Jones has shown no indications to this point that Wray is on his radar.
Jono Ross, Sale Sharks
Ross qualifies for England through his grandmother and after an impressive 2017/18 season with Sale, his name has been mentioned a few times in regard to international selection. He has experience of playing eight at club level and combines well with England’s current openside, Tom Curry.
Pros: Impressive work rate on both sides of the ball, impact at the contact area and not afraid of going to work in the tight.
Cons: Little international experience, not a powerhouse carrier and lacks the dynamism to win at the gain-line in alternative ways.
Ben Earl, Saracens
Earl was an unused tourist for England this summer in South Africa, despite still being eligible to play at the World Rugby U20 Championship. He is more likely an option for England to look at after the Rugby World Cup, but with so many back rowers going down, Jones could turn to him earlier than expected.
Pros: Extremely mobile, wins at the gain-line in alternative ways and brings the work rate and energy that is expected of Saracens players.
Cons: Little international experience, possibly not seen as a ‘natural eight’ and questions over whether, at this point in his career, he could make the hard yards around the contact area in international rugby.
In other news: Kurtley Beale talks about the effect of wearing the indigenous jersey with England’s upcoming opponents, Australia.
Comments on RugbyPass
This is the problem with conservative mindsets and phycology, and homogenous sports, everybody wants to be the same, use the i-win template. Athlete wise everyone has to have muscles and work at the gym to make themselves more likely to hold on that one tackle. Do those players even wonder if they are now more likely to be tackled by that player as a result of there “work”? Really though, too many questions, Jake. Is it better Jake? Yes, because you still have that rugby of ole that you talk about. Is it at the highest International level anymore? No, but you go to your club or checkout your representative side and still engage with that ‘beautiful game’. Could you also have a bit of that at the top if coaches encouraged there team to play and incentivized players like Damian McKenzie and Ange Capuozzo? Of course we could. Sadly Rugby doesn’t, or didn’t, really know what direction to go when professionalism came. Things like the state of northern pitches didn’t help. Over the last two or three decades I feel like I’ve been fortunate to have all that Jake wants. There was International quality Super Rugby to adore, then the next level below I could watch club mates, pulling 9 to 5s, take on the countries best in representative rugby. Rugby played with flair and not too much riding on the consequences. It was beautiful. That largely still exists today, but with the world of rugby not quite getting things right, the picture is now being painted in NZ that that level of rugby is not required in the “pathway” to Super Rugby or All Black rugby. You might wonder if NZR is right and the pathway shouldn’t include the ‘amateur’, but let me tell you, even though the NPC might be made up of people still having to pull 9-5s, we know these people still have dreams to get out of that, and aren’t likely to give them. They will be lost. That will put a real strain on the concept of whether “visceral thrill, derring-do and joyful abandon” type rugby will remain under the professional level here in NZ. I think at some point that can be eroded as well. If only wanting the best athlete’s at the top level wasn’t enough to lose that, shutting off the next group, or level, or rugby players from easy access to express and showcase themselves certainly will. That all comes back around to the same question of professionalism in rugby and whether it got things right, and rugby is better now. Maybe the answer is turning into a “no”?
34 Go to commentsWow, didn’t realise there was such apathy to URC in SA, or by Champions Cup teams. Just read Nick’s article on Crusaders, are Sharks a similar circumstance? I think SA rugby has been far more balanced than NZs, no?
2 Go to commentsBut here in Australia we were told Penney was another gun kiwi coach, for the Tahs…….and yet again it turned out the kiwi coach was completely useless. Another con job on Australian rugby. As was Robbie Deans, as was Dave Rennie. Both coaches dumped from NZ and promoted to Australia as our saviour. And the Tahs lap them up knowing they are second rate and knowing that under pressure when their short comings are exposed in Australia as well, that they will fall in below the largest most powerful province and choose second rate Tah players to save their jobs. As they do and exactly as Joe Schmidt will do. Gauranteed. Schmidt was dumped by NZ too. That’s why he went overseas. That why kiwi coaches take jobs in Australia, to try and prove they are not as bad as NZ thought they were. Then when they get found out they try and ingratiate themselves to NZ again by dragging Australian teams down with ridiculous selections and game plans. NZ rugby’s biggest problem is that it can’t yet transition from MCaw Cheatism. They just don’t know how to try and win on your merits. It is still always a contest to see how much cheating you can get away with. Without a cheating genius like McCaw, they are struggling. This I think is why my wise old mate in NZ thinks Robertson will struggle. The Crusaders are the nursery of McCaw Cheatism. Sean Fitzpatrick was probably the father of it. Robertson doesn’t know anything else but other countries have worked it out.
15 Go to commentsIt could be coincidental or prescient that the All Blacks most dominant period under Steve Hansen was when the Crusaders had their least successful period under Todd Blackadder and then the positions reversed when Razor took over the Crusaders.
15 Go to commentsDefinitely sound read everybodyexpects immediate results these days, I don't think any team would travel well at all having lost three of the most important game changers in the game,compiled with the massive injury list they are now carrying, good to see a different more in depth perspective of a coaches history.
3 Go to commentsSinckler is a really big loss for English rugby.
1 Go to commentsThanks Nick The loss of players to OS, injury and retirement is certainly not helping the Crusaders. Ditto the coach. IMO Penny is there to hold the fort and cop the flak until new players and a new coach come through,…and that's understood and accepted by Penny and the Crusaders hierarchy. I think though that what is happening with the Crusaders is an indicator of what is happening with the other NZ SRP teams…..and the other SRP teams for that matter. Not enough money. The money has come via the SR competition and it’s not there anymore. It's in France, Japan and England. Unless or until something is done to make SR more SELLABLE to the NZ/Australia Rugby market AND the world rugby market the $s to keep both the very best players and the next rung down won't be there. They will play away from NZ more and more. I think though that NZ will continue to produce the players and the coaches of sufficient strength for NZ to have the capacity to stay at the top. Whether they do stay at the top as an international team will depend upon whether the money flowing to SRP is somehow restored, or NZ teams play in the Japan comp, or NZ opts to pick from anywhere. As a follower of many sports I’d have to say that the organisation and promotion of Super Rugby has been for the last 20 years closest to the worst I’ve ever seen. This hasn't necessarily been caused by NZ, but it’s happened. Perhaps it can be fixed, perhaps not. The Crusaders are I think a symptom of this, not the cause
15 Go to commentsNo way. If you are trying to picture New Zealand rugby with an All Blacks mindset, there have been two factors instrumental to the decline of NZ rugby to date. Those are the horror that the Blues have become and, probably more so, the fixture that the Crusaders became. I don’t think it was healthy to have one team so dominant for so long, both for lack of proper representation of players from outside that environment and on the over reliance on players from within it. If you are another international side, like Ireland for example, sure. You can copy paste something succinct from one level to the next and experience a huge increase in standards, but ultimately you will not be maximizing it, which is what you need to perform to the level the ABs do. Added to that is the apathy that develops in the whole game as a result of one sides dominance. NZ, Super, and Championship rugby should all experience a boom as a result of things balancing out. That said, there is a lot of bad news happening in NZ rugby recently, and I’m not sure the game can be handled well enough here to postpone the always-there feeling of inevitable decline of rugby.
15 Go to commentsNo SA supporter miss Super Rugby - a product that is experiencing significant head wind in ANZ - the competition from rival codes are intense, match attendance figures are at a historical low and the negativity of commentators such as Kirwan and Wilson have accelerated the downward spiral in NZ. After the next RWC in 2027 sponsors will follow Qantas and start leaving in droves.
2 Go to commentsLike others, I am not seeing the connection between this edition of the Crusaders and the All Blacks future prospects under Razor. I think the analysis of the Crusaders attack recently is helpful because Razor and his coaching team used to be able to slot new guys in to their systems and see them succeed. Several of Razor’s coaches are still there so it would be surprising if the current attack and set piece has been overhauled to a great extent - but based on that analysis, it may have been. Whether it is too many new guys due to injuries or retirement or a failure of current Crusaders systems is the main question to be answered imo. It doesn’t seem relevant for the ABs.
15 Go to commentsharry potter is set in stone. he creates stability and finishes well. exactly what schmidt likes. he’s the ben smith of australian rugby. i think it could quite easily be potter toole and kellaway for the foreseeable future.
5 Go to commentsThis is short sighted from Clayton if you ask me, smacks of too much preseason planning and no adaptability. What if DMac is out for a must win match, are they still only going to bring their best first five and playmaker on late in the game? Trusting the game to someone who wasn’t even part of planning (they would have had Trask pinned in as Jacomb preseason). Perhaps if the Crusaders were better they would not have done this, but either way imo you take this opportunity to play a guy you might need starting in a final rather than having their 12th game getting comfortable coming off the bench.
1 Go to commentsThanks Brett.. At last a positive article on the potential of Wallaby candidates, great to read. Schmidt’s record as an international rugby coach speaks for itself, I’m somewhat confident he will turn the Wallaby’s fortunes around …. on the field. It will be up to others to steady the ship off the paddock. But is there a flaw in my optimism? We have known all along that Australia has the players to be very competitive with their international rivals. We know that because everyone keeps telling us. So why the poor results? A question that requires a definitive answer before the turn around can occur. Joe Schmidt signed on for 2 years, time to encompass the Lions tour of 2025. By all accounts he puts family first and that’s fair enough, but I would wager that his 2 year contract will be extended if the next 18 months or so shows the statement “Australia has the players” proves to be correct. The new coach does not have a lot of time to meld together an outfit that will be competitive in the Rugby Championship - it will be interesting to see what happens. It will be interesting to see what happens with Giteau law, the new Wallaby coach has already verbalised that he would to prefer to select from those who play their rugby in Australia. His first test in charge is in July just over 3 months away .. not a long time. I for one wish him well .. heaven knows Australia needs some positive vibes.
21 Go to commentsWhat a load of bollocks. The author has forgotten to mention the fact that the Crusaders have a huge injury toll with top world class players out. Not to mention the fact that they are obviously in a transition period. No this will not spark a slow death for NZ rugby, but it does mean there will be a new Super Rugby champion. Anyone who knows anything about NZ rugby knows that there is some serious talent here, it just isn’t all at the Crusaders.
15 Go to commentsI wouldn’t spend the time on Nawaqanitawase! No point in having him filling in a jersey when he’s committed to leave Union. Give the jersey to a young prospect who will be here in the future.
5 Go to commentsIt was a pleasure to watch those guys playing with such confidence. That trio can all be infuriating for different reasons and I can see why Jones might have decided against them. No way to justify leaving Ikitau out though. Jorgensen and him were both scheduled to return at the same time. Only one of them plays for Randwick and has a dad who is great mates with the national coach though.
53 Go to commentsBrayden Iose and Peter Lakai are very exciting Super Rugby players but are too short and too light to ever be a Test 8 vs South Africa, France, Ireland, and England, Lakai could potentially be a Test player at 7 if he is allowed to focus on 7 for Hurricanes.
7 Go to commentsPencils “Thomas du Toit” into possible 2027 Bok squad.
1 Go to commentsDon’t see why Harrison makes the bench. Jones can play at 10 if needed, and there is a good case for starting her there to begin with if testing combinations. That would leave room for Sing on the bench
1 Go to commentsWhat a load of old bull!
1 Go to comments