'It's going to be a dagger': Kiwi Super players on why New Zealand Rugby can't lose the Springboks
With news reports surfacing this week of South Africa joining an eight-team competition in November, fears are growing that a full exodus from SANZAAR by South Africa will become a reality.
For New Zealand Rugby, the ramifications would be far reaching off the field as well as on it.
Blues duo James Parsons and Tony Lamborn and Bryn Hall of the Crusaders discussed on this week’s Aotearoa Rugby Pod what would happen if South Africa’s Super Rugby sides left for Europe and potentially opened the door for the Springboks to find a new home in an expanded Six Nations.
“It’s going to be a bit of a dagger,” said Bryn Hall of the four South African Super Rugby sides, “for those boys to leave to go to the Pro14 in Europe.”
Hall believes the Springboks and All Blacks clash is the pinnacle test match of the international calendar, describing their would-be departure as “a massive blow”.
“They are our oldest foe, and yes we have the Bledisloe Cup which is dear to our heart, but every time we get to play South Africa in The Rugby Championship, for whatever reason, there is just no better test match.
“It’s going to be a massive loss if they head off. It will be a massive blow for us having that calibre of players leave.”
USA flanker Tony Lamborn, who was born and raised in the South Island of New Zealand, explained that historical matches between the All Blacks and the Springboks were a defined part of his childhood memories, getting up in the wee hours to watch the games with his family.
“As a kid growing up, waking up in the early hours to watch the All Blacks play South Africa, those are my memories. My old man making a hot chocolate and sitting there watching those games,” Blues flanker Tony Lamborn recalled.
“I’ll be absolutely gutted if they were to withdraw.”
Lamborn explained the feeling within some players in South Africa is a preference towards playing in the Northern Hemisphere.
“I’ve got a couple of mates in South Africa and they feel it is a lot easier for them to just play in Europe and play over there.”
Blues teammate James Parsons surmised that the demand for the Springboks following their World Cup victory is aiding their leverage, and that the financial rewards available in the North Hemisphere are tempting.
“Covid has opened things to change. They are the world champions, so they are in hot demand. They’ll end up somewhere, but there are so many variables to go into it.
“Not just the players comfort of being in the timezone, but she’s a different bracket of dough when you go up to the Northern Hemisphere. There is a reason a lot of players go up there after playing for their home nations and achieving what they want to in international rugby. It’s a different kettle of fish in that sense.
“What does Springbok rugby look like when they go and join Northern Hemisphere competition? There are so many variables that can impact the decision.
“Say it happens, say they leave, do we think that it will hamper All Black rugby? Does our depth, our talent pool, our ability to play each other keep us strong? Do we need that nation that bad?'” he asked.
Crusaders halfback Bryn Hall was adamant that without the Springboks, New Zealand Rugby could suffer. He said it won’t just be South Africa that benefits, the top sides of the Northern Hemisphere will all strengthen in an “iron sharpens iron” way.
“We 100 percent need them,” Hall said of South Africa’s involvement in SANZAAR.
“If we were to lose them, and no disrespect to Australia, with the change of guard they are going through and their struggles with depth in Super Rugby, you think about South Africa going up to the Northern Hemisphere, the likes of France, England, Ireland, Wales, all those team playing against each other, its only going to make them better.
“Who do we go to? So, it’s us, Aussie and possibly Argentina, Japan, do you think of a Pacific Island team? Who knows.
“I just think the level of competition, we would be at a disadvantage.”
Hall’s view was shared by Lamborn, who says the type of rugby the Springboks play is unique to them and gives the All Blacks a different kind of contest.
“I agree 100 percent, it’s bringing the best out of players, you get a different style of game out of them [Springboks], it’s that physical game for the All Blacks.
“South Africa are nailing their set piece, relying on their lineout, their mauling, their scrummaging, and I just don’t think you are going to get that with the Australians and Argentina.”
Parsons was a strong believer in the future of the Wallabies under Dave Rennie, which would potentially help the All Blacks receive fiercer competition. He said if South Africa is lost to Southern Hemisphere rugby, it is a case of rebuilding with what is left.
“With Aussie, with Dave Rennie, I just think they are going to thrive. The more and more I watch Super Rugby AU, they are on their way back. I genuinely believe that, I’m not just saying that.
“I think they will be a lot stronger under his guidance, he’s come at the right time where there is a really strong young group, their U20 team has been really successful the last couple of years, and he’s got a proven track record out of bringing the best out of young men, mentoring them with their careers.
“There’s also Japan, let’s not forget what they achieved in the World Cup. We’ve got this potential opportunity of growing the Pacific game, which has been a dream for a long time, and we have Argy, we don’t know where they are at.
“I agree, we can’t lose the Springboks, but I still think there is the opportunity to create something strong enough to keep us strong, but also the Southern Hemisphere strong.”
Listen to the full episode of the Aotearoa Rugby Pod below
Comments on RugbyPass
Word in France is that he’s on the radar of a few Top14 clubs.
2 Go to commentsGet blocking Travis, this guy has styles and he’s gonna make a swift impact…!
1 Go to commentsWhat remorse? She claimed that her dangerous tackle wasn’t worthy of a red! She should be compensating the injured player for loss of earnings at the minimum. Her ban should include the recovery time of the injured player as well as the paltry 3 match ban.
4 Go to commentsArdie is a legend. Finished and klaar. Two things: “Yeah, yeah, I have had a few conversations with Razor just around feedback on my game and what I am doing well, what I need to improve on or work-ons. It’s kind of been minimal, mate, but it’s all that I need over here in terms of how to be better, how to get better and what I am doing well.” I hope he’s downplaying it - and that it’s not that “minimal”. The amount of communication and behind the scenes preparation the Bok coaches put into players - Rassie and co would be all over Ardie and being clear on what is expected of him. This stands out for me as something teams should really be looking at in terms of the boks success from a coaching point of view. And was surprised by the comment - “minimal”. In terms of the “debate” around Ireland and South Africa. Nice one Ardie. Indeed. There’s no debate.
1 Go to commentsThere’s a bit of depth there but realistically Australian players have a long way to go to now catch up. The game is moving on fast and Australia are falling behind. Australian sides still don’t priories the breakdown like they should, it’s a non-negotiable if you want to compete on the international stage. That goes for forwards and backs. The Australian team could have a back row that could make a difference but the problem is they don’t have a tight five that can do the business. Tupou is limited in defence, overweight and unfit and the locks are a long way from international standard. Frost is soft and Salakai-Loto is too small so that means they need a Valentini at 8 who has to do the hard graft so limits the effectiveness of the backrow. Schmidt really needs to get a hard working, tough tight 5 if he wants to get this team firing.
3 Go to commentsSorry Morgan you must have been the “go to for a quote” ex player this week. Its rnd 6 and there is plenty of time to cement a starting 15 and finishing 8 so I have no such concerns.
2 Go to commentsGreat read. I wish you had done this article on the ROAR.
2 Go to commentsThe current AB coaching team is basically the Crusaders so it smacks of wanting their familiar leaders around. This is not a good look for the future of the ABs or the younger players in Super working their way up the player ladder. Razor is touted as innovative, forward looking but his early moves look like insecurity and insular, provincial thinking. He is the AB's coach not the Golden Oldies.
10 Go to commentsSimple reason for wanting him back. Robertson wants him as captain. Otherwise he wouldn’t be bothering chasing him. Not enough reason to come back just to mentor.
10 Go to commentsI had not considered this topic like this at all, brilliant read. I had been looking at his record at the Waratahs and thought it odd the Crusaders appointed him, then couple that with all that experience and talent departing and boom. They’ve got some great talent developing though, and in all honesty I don’t think anyone would be over confident taking them on in a playoff match, no matter how poor the first half of their season was. I think they can pull a game out of their ass when it counts.
2 Go to commentsNot a bad list but not Porecki and not Donaldson. Not because they are Tahs, or Ex Tahs, they are just not good enough. Edmed should be ahead. Far more potential. Wilson should be 8 and Valentini 6. Wilson needs to be told by his father and his coach, stop bloody running in to brick wall defence. You’re not playing under the genius Thorn any more. He’s a fantastic angle runner. The young new 8 from the Brumbies looks really good too. The Lonegrans are just too small for international rugby as is Paisami, as is Hamish Stewart at 12. Both great at Super Rugby level. Stewart could have been a great 10 if not for Brad Thorn. Uru should be there and so should Tupou. Tupou just needs good Australian coaching which he hasn’t been getting. I don’t think Schmidt will excite him.
3 Go to commentsIf he wants to come back then he should. He will be a major asset to the younger locks and could easily be played as an impact player off the bench coming on in the last 30. He is fit, strong and capable and has all the experience to make up for any loss in physical prowess. He could also be brought back with a view to coaching within the structures one day. Duane Vermeulen played until he was 37 or 38. He is now a roaming coach within the South African coaching structures. He was valuable in the last world cup and has been a major influence on Jasper Wiese and other young players which has helped and accelerated their development and growth. Whitelock could do the exact same thing for NZ
10 Go to commentsBrett Excellent words… finally someone (other than DC) has noted that Hanigan is very hard and very good at doing what Backrow should do… his performance via the Drua sauna was quite daunting for those on the other side… very high tackle count… carries with good end result… constant threat to make a good 20-25 meters with those long legs… providing his mass effectively to crunching the Drua pack… Finally he is returning to quality form… way to much injury time over the last 2 years… smart-strong-competent in his skills… caught every lineout throw aimed at him and delivered clean pass to whoever was down below… and he worked hard for the whole 80 minutes… Ned has to be in the top 5 for backrow honors… He knows what is required as he has been there before…
20 Go to commentsI think Sam Whitelock should not touch a return with a bargepole. He went out on a high, playing in the RWC Final. He would be coming back into a team that will be weaker than last years, and might even be struggling to win games, especially against the Boks. Stay in France, enjoy another year with Pau, playing alongside his brother.
10 Go to commentsRyan Coxon has been very impressive considering he was signed by WF as injury cover whilst Uru has been a standout for QR, surprised neither of those mentioned
3 Go to commentsIt’s the massive value he brings with regard team culture/values, preparation, etc. Can’t buy that. I’m hoping to see the young locks get their chance in the big games though.
10 Go to commentsAll good, Gregor, except that you neglected to mention Sam Darry amongst that talented pool of locks. In fact, given Hannah’s inexperience and the fact that Holland won’t be eligible until next year, Lord and Darry might be the frontrunners this year, to join Barrett, Tuipoluto, Va’ii and possibly Whitelock. In fact there might be room for all of them if Barrett played 6 (like Ollie Chessum).
10 Go to commentsHis value is stabilizing the ship 20 - 40 minutes out from the final whistle plus his valuable experience to the underlings coming through.
10 Go to commentsWhat is criminal is she acts like it's no problem her actions have have cause the Italian player to lose her playing career, lose salary, if she did this in day to day life she would be in jail, she is a complete thug!!!
4 Go to commentsCorrect me if i’m wrong but the sadas have to win all games running into the finals yeh nah?
1 Go to comments